In this special interview for PiL Official, John Lydon brings us up to date with what’s been happening with PiL, and reveals plans for a new record and future worldwide tours. He also talks for the first time about the departure of long-serving drummer Bruce Smith, and working with Alan McGee.
Funny how things can turn around when you least expect them to. When Public Image Limited (PiL) came off the road after their last tour, their future was far from certain. The band’s long-time manager and best friend of John Lydon, John Rambo Stevens, died suddenly, shortly after the tour. There were questions over the band’s line-up, too, with drummer Bruce Smith a doubt. Those changes, so soon after the death in 2023 of John Lydon’s lifelong partner, Nora Forster, meant the last thing on anyone’s mind was a new PiL record, or another PiL tour.
Hope, however, springs eternal. And now PiL are back with a huge tour, that’s as much a statement of intent as it is a chance to re-engage with fans. It won’t be the last. This Is Not The Last Tour will take PiL around the UK and Ireland, through Belgium and The Netherlands, Denmark and Germany, Poland and the Czech Republic, Italy and Spain.
There are also plans to visit South America, North America, and Australasia in 2026, as well as recording a new record.
The genesis of a period of intense creativity came in Spring 2024. John Lydon had taken to the road for a Q&A tour of 50 UK venues. Given the challenges in his life, it was the last thing he needed. He was, however, in no mind to let down fans who’d bought tickets. “I never, never, never, never go back on my word,” he says. “I’d got commitments, and my fans know that I never, never, never let them down.”
As he engaged in endless meet’n’greets, spending time with thousands of people for whom PiL loomed large, he witnessed an outpouring of love. That deep sense of affection and respect provided a well-spring and by the end of the tour, the return of PiL no longer seemed like a remote possibility – it was some sort of duty.
A new drummer was asked to rehearse as Bruce Smith decided not to return for personal reasons, a new support network emerged in the post-Rambo era. And suitably ambitious plans were put in place to take PiL around the UK and mainland Europe. PiL, in short, were back, making a show of profound strength as they embarked upon a new era. As has always been the case, Lydon is a man who thrives on adversity.
“I’ve been in two bands in my life and the one that’s the most important is Public Image Limited. Over the course of a year, a lot of tragedy went on. I lost my missus and then I lost my best friend. I didn’t think I’d really have the energy to go back out on tour after those two calamitous kicks to the brain. But I was committed to doing a talking tour. I never let people down, once I’ve committed. After doing it, the enthusiasm and the empathy from the audience was an amazing thing. It kick-started me back into being myself.”
There’s another thing, too. Lydon is a worker. Not for him the easy schedule of other rock’n’roll stars. Though he happily enjoys long periods with his couch, from time to time, he’s also rigorous in making good on his commitments. A man of 69 years with the constitution of a person 40 years younger, he’s driven to avoid self-pity and focuses instead on the here and the now.
Lydon says: “I might have fallen into self-pity if I hadn’t put a workload onto me. That’s an amazing thing. It’s like full cycle, I’ve come round. I know this as a fact: Rambo and Nora would never have tolerated me sitting on a couch being indolent. That was a trick that worked for me when they were alive, because I was being naughty. That’s gone. Now I just have to get up and do it. I’m fully enthusiastic to that. “On top of the Q&A tour, getting Public Image Limited back out there is really important to me because I really miss the music. We won’t have an album ready in time for this tour but we will be much more solid than anything we’ve ever done in the past – that’s enthusiasm for you.”
The reference to being ‘solid’ touches on the inevitable line-up changes that come with the times; in this case, the departure of Bruce Smith, who played with PiL from 1986-1990, and then again from 2009-2024. Lydon was hoping Smith would pull through – and will miss him.
“We had an issue with our drummer Bruce, who had some kind of personal issue that really shattered him. We’re finding a new long-term replacement who we hope to announce soon. And don’t worry – there’s enough people volunteering for it. The new drummer won’t be someone who’s famous, because I can’t be dealing with egos. There’s only room for one on that bus – and that’s usually the tour manager, not me.
“And there it is. It’s an extensive tour that even at the height of my fitness would have been challenging. But God, I’m only 69, that’s a good age – it’s nice and rude, too.”
It’s not just a PiL tour, however. Such was the demand for Lydon’s spoken word tour in 2024 that he’ll be back out again in Autumn 2025. That, like the PiL tour, will take a full three months, covering Ireland, Northern Ireland, Scotland, Wales, and England, between September and November. It’s a crazy, intense schedule, during which Lydon will be on the road for a full six months, playing with his band, then dispensing wisdom, of sorts, as he meets fans for an evening of spoken word.
Lydon remains iconic. Though he’s ever-loathe to engage with such opinions, preferring to keep his feet firmly planted on terra firma, he’s a game-changing, force of nature whose contribution to culture and music is unsurpassed. Little wonder, then, that there was no shortage of suitors who wanted to help propel PiL forward. They are, after all, a totemic band who’ve continued to shape-shift since their ground-breaking 1978 debut, First Issue, and still-great 1979 sophomore album, Metal Box right up to their last three critically acclaimed albums released via their own PiL Official label. The last being End of World in 2023.
“The most surprising element of the past year has been the emergence of really interesting people from the music industry who want to work with me. It’s a fantastic list of names and I’m sorry if I can’t rattle them all off. Alan McGee is an obvious start point, though. His name’s always popped up in my life but for some weird reason we never got together – but now we have, and that definitely helps the motivation. We have a new, touring agent Neil O’Brien, and we met and had a very good drinking session; we got on fantastically. He’s come in with such a magnificent work ethic. He’s shown us that so many people want us. There are others – splendid mates, friends, who have helped me get through a lot of things. The thing that works for me – and PiL – is that. It’s friends. With friends, you have empathy, and you build from that. And I’m surrounded by splendid people. They’ve helped me get through a lot of things. It’s all about friends you can trust. I don’t work with enemies.”
PiL is family. It’s a disparate group of people – long-time guitarist, Lu Edmonds, and long-standing bassist, Scott Firth – as well as a small number of respected, trusted team players, who move the band forward. “PiL is my community. I treat the people in PiL like my neighbours. Generally speaking, the sour pusses aren’t welcome and we let that me know from the start – and then you get on like a superbly. PiL tours like a Viking raiding party bringing gifts – it’s like Monty Python lupins – but our gifts are non-returnable and non-refundable.”
2025 is shaping up to be a vintage year. And 2026 promises to be even better. Lydon is keen to make a new record, is looking forward to a longer, world tour, and is excited, too, by the presence of a new drummer. “We’re looking forward to the energy that’s brought to the party. Anyone who works with me closely knows that I’m not actually that difficult to work with; I’m actually quite the opposite.”
Quite the opposite, indeed. The excitement surrounding PiL is infectious. The band is catching a wave. Some shows sold out within a week of release, several others are on their way to doing so.
“Lu Edmonds and Scott Firth have been magnificent with me and they’re both gagging at the bit. I love them two so much, they are such decent, human beings, and we will have some fun together. PiL isn’t over. It’s very, very serious hard work but I’m nowhere near old enough to complain about that. I’m working class. No surrender. We like it.”
And so do the fans. The appetite for the return of PiL, and, thereafter, for Lydon’s spoken word shows, is acute. It’s time to strap yourself in and buckle up. It promises to be one helluva ride.
Dates for PiL’s 2025 tour and John Lydon’s spoken word tour are both available at:
https://www.pilofficial.com/tour
https://www.pilofficial.com/john-lydon-shows
Interview for PiL Official by Andy Richardson, January 2025
